Victoria Dawson, the legal writing director at the FAMU College of Law has come under fire from students who have questioned how she ever got her job. Ms. Dawson who joined the FAMU staff in 2005 after holding a similar position at Texas Southern University had shopped an error filled paper around with the hopes of getting it published in a legal journal.An English education professor at the University of South Florida who reviewed Dawson's paper at the St. Petersburg Times' request, said in an e-mail that the paper was "sloppily written, in need of serious proofreading."
Continue reading: Errors mar law prof's paper
The St Pete Times is one sided in that it fails to print anything positive about FAMU even if the event happens in it`s own back yard. This is really a travesty of the highest order.
ReplyDelete95% of the jobs at the LAW SCHOOL were obtained through "personal" ties. That does not mean that a person is not qualified. It is sad that we have sunk to a new low by entangling with an enemy, the St. Pete times, to destroy ourselves. But FAMU brought this on itself when it brought to the school students, faculty and staff who shoule NEVER have been there.
ReplyDelete95% of the jobs at the LAW SCHOOL were obtained through "personal" ties.
ReplyDeletejust like most jobs, so what?
Anonn @ 9:33 So What? is my point. People normally bring on board those who they know. The main difference in academia is that it is usually a state institution that is also subject to the approval of a body (such as the ABA) and, therefore, we must be careful to follow the hiring, retention and firing guidelines so that we DON'T run into these problems.
ReplyDeleteThe St. Pete Times and its sources (many of whom are themselves in jobs that they are not qualified for)clearly hates FAMU, but when we are above reproach their criticism will fall flat.
As Florida Evans would say: Damn, Damn, Damn!!!!!! As I read excerpts from the professor's paper, I literally cringed and was straight up embarrassed. As a legal writing director, she should know better (and I don't care if it was a DRAFT). This is unacceptable! How can FAMU Law gain accreditation with faculty like this? Better yet, how can FAMU Law's graduates write briefs, complaints, etc. when they are being taught by this woman? Totally unacceptable. As black attorneys, we are already treated like clerks/paralegals when we walk into law firms with our degrees and Bar cards. We have to perform 110% better because the white attorneys do not expect us to know anything and then, when we win a case or make outstanding legal arguments, they act like they are shocked. Man, this article has set us back. FAMU Law and Dean Witherspoon need to wake the hell up before the ABA comes a knockin' and snatches the hell out of that provisional accreditation.
ReplyDelete8:50---The "travesty of the highest order" is not that the SPT has reported this, but that an article replete with errors has been bandied about for publication. That, my dear, is the "travesty." Don't get mad at the messenger. Sometimes a spade is a spade, and sometimes things cannot be excused, no matter whose backyard it is.
ReplyDeleteIt is about time. The students have been going nuts trying to deal with this woman as an instructor, never mind director. Fine for Douglas to bring in some of "his people" from Texas; what about credentials and minimum competence? Let's not forget the instructor that Dawson had fired (and that Witherspoon went through with) because the instructor can write AND teach...at the same time! This has nothing to do with race by the way - incompetence is in fact blind.
ReplyDeleteBy the way, what about the other writing instructors? Can't pass a bar exam and they are passing themselves off as qualified to decide on whether a student should pass or fail? Then again, I guess they are familiar with the failing grade. Let's hope that the ABA doesn't dish it out too.
I went to the SPT site, read the passages, and I must say, from the perspective of a writing instructor, the online passages are horrendous.
ReplyDeleteThe excerpts are worth reading. Make up your own mind.
ReplyDeleteExcerpts from the paper
* "This reports served as a welcome-mate to concerned groups seeking to resolve potential conflicts regarding international environmental concerns, thus allow disputing parties the opportunity to be heard in an agreeable dispute resolution procedure."
* "This inherent conflict between economic development and environmental protection needs and interest and the focus of managing environmental disputes for sustainable results is the cause of a 10-day delay in productions and obligations."
* "Such an institutional framework would include implementation of sound sustainable development strategies and international treaties by countries should contribute to improved socioeconomic and environmental conditions, and help reduce potential sources of conflict between countries."
* "International environmental disputes can involve parties who hold very strong feelings that they are right and other parties are wrong present unique challenges if fundamental values are in conflict."
* "Borrowing from the environmental dispute strategy of the local threats and the focus of Agenda 21 with the sustainable development flavor it is dispute settlement that is one of the key elements to ensure that the environmental dimensions of security can be maintained."
I just posted the excerpts above.
ReplyDeleteNow, here's something of a defense of Dawson, claiming (as I understand it) she merely posted an unedited first draft in a forum established for that purpose:
http://prawfsblawg.blogs.com/prawfsblawg/2007/06/a_cautionary_ta.html#more
Ms. Dawson shouldn't have a high school diploma let alone a college degree (or degrees). The tragedy is that public school teachers and college professors are intimidated. Not overtly, of course, but educators fear being called racist if they flunk a black student who clearly can't write a meaningful and grammatically correct sentence. It is doubtful Ms. Dawson would ever be able to work in a large private or public law school where the conpetition for such jobs weeds out the marginally literate.
ReplyDeleteIt b-u-r-d doesn't spell bird, what the hell does it spell?
ReplyDeleteFORGET THAT PROFESSOR'S PAPER - Have any of you seen the 40 page full color booklet (actually a BOOK) that was sent out this week to everyone from Alumni Affairs - "In Perspective."
ReplyDeleteCan someone please find out how that enormous, error filled, FULL OF LIES, cleverly planned by the interim president or someone, already out of date booklet cost the University?
It appears that it was done somewhere around the first of the year, since it contains a January 2007 date on the back.
And why would you spend good $$$$ that the University does not have on such an enormous mailout?
Someone please tell the V.P. for Student Affairs that he has two errors in the first sentence and several throughout that section.
Someone please tell Vivian Hobbs that "Resolved pending issues from the 1998 SACS Review" must not have happened, because they are coming back this month (see inside of back cover).
Someone else should tell the editor what DRS stands for.
And get this on, page 31, "In addition to decreases in consultant fees, changes were made to the procurement process..." ROTFL WHAT A JOKE!!!
Okay. Okay. This is the last one... "Prudent stewardship of financial resources has been a top priority since 2005 and is crucial to meeting the university's future financial demands. The University takes seriously its role of financial stewardship and works hard to manage its financial resources effectively."
If you don't believe this, call one of your neighbors and ask to see his/her copy. On page 11, "Increased alumni mailing list to more than 30,000 FAMU graduates." At .50 to mail each of these, (not counting the cost of the printing), that's $15,000.
I think I had the most laughs from looking at the Leadership Team on the back cover - January 1, 2007 was how long ago? Only 5 months - 10 of those folks have already left
So why is this book coming out now? WHY? WHY? WHY? Comments?
Since Dr. Bryant mentions Dr. Ammons in her message on the inside front cover, obviously this document was approved for publishing after February 2, 2007.
ReplyDeleteOh, Drs. Lewis, Mobley, Beck, etc. were honored on February 27th, so I guess it was after that date also.
I agree with you in asking, "WHY?"
No, the book must have been completed later, as the Budget Office page shows comprehensive plans that were developed for ALL employees in the Division. "Program implemented in March 2007"
ReplyDeleteMany of the buildings shown on the construction page were approved under Dr. Humphries' leadership. The Construction and Facilities Management page implies that these construction projects were part of 2005-2007 regime.
Dang, I haven't checked my mailbox. I must do that tomorrow.
ReplyDeleteWhy would the SP Times or any other newspaper care about a professor's paper? That's kind of silly to even write about. Isn't there enough other newsworthy "stuff" happening in this world that would interest readers?
ReplyDeleteAND DO ANY OF YOU HERE REALLY CARE WHAT A PROFESSOR'S PAPER LOOKS LIKE? That's between that person and the publisher/editor of the journal (or whomever) plans to publish it. Don't you agree?
7:49--It's even worse. We don't even know how much of the alleged mistakes were fabrications by the newspaper. Also, this is clearly a vendetta. One of the legal writing instructor's contract was not renewed partly on Dawson's recommendation. You do the math. You are right, who cares about alleged mistakes in one paper. By the way, I heard the ABA chided the law faculty for being lazy and not producing enough good quality writing. I wonder what most of them are doing this summer.
ReplyDelete7:49 and 9:10, I think you are both missing the point. FAMU Law cannot compete if it has faculty who are unable to write a sentence without a run-on. In addition, FAMU law grads will be disadvantaged by having this woman teaching them. It's that simple! I do believe the SP Times article b/c many FAMU law students have been complaining about this woman's incompetence for at least the past year. I think Dawson's work speaks for itself and she has no place in academia. Perhaps she should get a job at her local Walmart where sentence structure is not important. But, this has nothing to do with racism. I am a black attorney and anyone who writes like that (black or white) should never have gotten past first year law school. So please, let's not play the race card here. This is an embarrassment to say the least!
ReplyDeleteI teach senior level and graduate classes in one of SBI's "flagship" programs. A few semesters ago, I changed my testing format from multiple choice to short answer. I also had the students write papers for me. I came to the sad realization that and most (80%)of my students are marginally literate. How in the WORLD did they make it to senior status?
ReplyDeleteI yelled. I shamed them. I encouraged them. I loved them. I sent them to a tutor. I refused to accept illiteracy. They had to keep re-writing until it was correct.
In the end, they still could not write. It was too late for me to help them. It will only be a matter of months before their new employer finds out that we have confirmed graduation upon another barely literate African-American.
Our reputation will sink further.
I had a good cry.
God help us.
10:15--Who is playing the race card? I said nothing about race. Bringing the race card is a weak attempt at scoring points, just like calling someone a liberal in politics says nothing about the validity of the person's point of view, just an attempt to discredit the person. This will not work with me. All I said was that newspapers are not trustworthy (duh!!!), that we do not know whether these were fabrications and that there are people out there with an ax to grind. More importatnly, this was A DRAFT. Who has never erred on a draft should cast the first pen (or PC). Jumping to the conclusion that she has no place in academia is a lazy conclusion. Are we to let the St. Pete newspaper decide who is worthy of being hired by the law school? What about faculty who have produced nothing in the past 5-6 years, should they also be fired? We have to look at the full picture. What else does Dawson bring to the table? Is she hard working? If she has a writing problem, can it be addressed? Remember her role is that of a coach? Michael Jordan had plenty of coaches, do you think they could engage him on the basketball court? Could they nevertheless point weaknesses to him? Can Dawson play such a role? People who know her and are objective say yes. Is she collegial? These are the questions we need to investigage. One of the major problems of the law school (if not the major) AS POINTED BY THE ABA IN ITS REPORT (this is the truth, no bull) is faculty infighting. Why don't we address that? What about the well spoken and well written faculty who cause nothing but havocs and have caused major problems (say about 1,000 times more than Dawson could ever cause) at the school, how are they to be dealt with? It seems to me that we really have much bigger fish to fry than to argue about something insignificant.
ReplyDeleteWe all make writing mistakes (I just made some above), but when you turn something in for publication or for a grade, it should be proof read a few times.
ReplyDelete10:59,
ReplyDeleteAre you arguing that having a marginally literate writing instructor at (what we hope to be) a world class institution is an "insignificant problem?"
I meant 10:56, not 10:59.
ReplyDelete11:06--I hate to quote Ronald Reagan but there you go again. You sound a bit too personally involved and this may be clouding your judgment. We really could be doing something more productive.
ReplyDelete10:56, I went to Lexis and pulled the FINAL version of Dawson's paper and it still was incomprehensible. When the writer confuses the reader, that is not scholarly writing. Bottom line! I do believe Dawson is past the point of being coached. Her writing lacks the foundation that is necessary in any type of writing and then, for her to be hired as the legal writing DIRECTOR.....that is a problem! I don't see how you don't get it. However, I will say it again.....the woman has NO place in academia! And one of the posts said something about this "being a vendetta"....that is where I got the impression that the poster was attempting to play the race card. If that is an incorrect impression, I do apologize. A "draft" simply does not have the types of errors that are in Dawson's piece. I just cannot believe it and yes, this is a big deal....especially when FAMU Law's accreditation is at issue.
ReplyDeleteLet's remember that one of the problems of "scholarly" writing and the decline of respect for scholarly writing is that such writings are too long and CONFUSE THE READER. This is why Harvard and other elite schools have imposed a page limit on their articles. Saying that Dawson's paper confuses the reader sounds bad to the uninitiated but the reality is that professors, in general, do not do a good job in their writing and confuse many readers. If you are going to lodge this attack on her, it should be lodged against the teaching profession as a whole. Plus, this is her first piece, she has room to grow. I say: Let's embrace not discourage, let's help each other, not destroy each other. Are we not Christians after all? Would Christ do this? I am asking this seriously. Would you feel comfortable in front of your maker after making those vile accusations against someone who is doing the best she could under very difficult circumstances. If this is acceptable Christian behavior, then count me out.
ReplyDelete11:39, you need to read the excerpts from the paper. Look at 4:27's post from 6/6. Once you read those excerpts, if you can honestly say that you understand what Dawson is saying, then lawd help us! If she is doing the best she can, then that is further proof that she does not need to be in academia teaching our future lawyers. That is just the truth and you don't need to throw God into the equation for the pity party. Even God would want her to move on if she is not able to do what she has been hired to do. I believe the students' academic needs are more of a priority than helping her at this late hour....all while she earns 105K salary and our students are unable to pass the bar, write a legal brief, and ultimately, get that coveted clerkship or law firm internship. Say what you want, but "her ship done sunk."
ReplyDeleteMy Lord, my Lord! Will all this not end until they have completely destroyed the school? Why does this vindictive conduct continue?
ReplyDeleteIt is one thing if a "newsworthy" matter is published so that the public can be enlightened and the issue, whatever it is, resolved. It is quite another when anything is published solely to further a personal agenda or derail a professional competitor.
Very few people are concerned with the success of FAMU or the Law School. Many would like to see it fail. Many students have graduated from the law school and are doing extremely well in their professions. They will never be acknowledged by FAMU or any media outlet for their accomplishments.
There is a right way to bring correction when you see a wrong. This is not the right way. What you have here are people, who themselves are of low ethics, character and morals, attacking one professor. The problems at FAMU and at the law school are NOT limited to one person.
It is sick and sad to see all these folks using a media outlet in an attempt to hold on to jobs they were never entitled to or to strike back because they were or will be removed. Many of the folks at FAMU who ARE causing problems know that they would never find an equivalent job anywhere else (NOT EVEN AT WALMART) not only because they are not qualified but also because they have a nasty and bitter attitude that comes across even before you stand in their presence.
Those who keep going after others had better watch their backs. There is no such thing as a "friend" at that law school. Issues, especially those that are confidential in nature, have a way of leaking at the most critical points.
This is ugly, nasty, unethical, unprofessional, and absolutely without good taste or class. The people involved should not be in the legal profession or seeking entry to the legal profession.
Many of us had such high hopes and dreams when we walked into the law school. We wanted to accomplish so much and would have done and did do everything to support it, but the weight of a bad reputation and the lack of ethics is heavy. We learned that quickly when we entered the professional world with our "FAMU" diplomas. This disappointment hurts those of us who really care about the students and had hoped for a great future.
It hurts in a way that I cannot possibly describe. This is not remotely funny.
1. ambabambce or ambulance
ReplyDelete2. margins or margarins
3. leapers or lepers
DAWSON FLUNKED THE ABOVE MULTIPLE CHOICE TEST- SO YOU DO THE MATH-
12:57 is exactly an example of the problem at the law school. 12:57 is ready, able and willing to pounce on the weaknesses of others. Does he/she bring anything to the table? NOTHING but NEGATIVITY. Unfortunately, the law school is full of these types--result: low production, low bar passage, accreditation in jeopardy, a total mess. As Blacks we should be ashamed of ourselves. FIU received accreditation one year ahead of schedule. Where is FAMU? Still fighting among ourselves not uplifting ourselves. Still spending all our energy gossiping and talking about people behind their backs. What a waste? The only hope is that Ammons will start holding people accountable and will start handing out pink slips to those nasty naysayers.
ReplyDeleteTHE TRUTH HURTS! JUST BECAUSE IT HURTS DOESN'T MEAN IT ISNT TRUE, JUST BECAUSE IT IS POLITICALLY INCORRECT TO SAY DOESN'T MEAN THAT ITS A LIE. GROW UP- GROWN UPS IF YOU TALK THE TALK THEN WALK THE WALK! THOSE THAT ARE THROWING THE SMOKE BOMBS ARE THOSE THAT HAVE ALLOWED THIS TYPE OF INCOMPETENCE TO FERMENT AT OUR ESTEEMED COL- PINK SLIPS ARE IN ORDER- AND YOU ARE PROBABLY THE FIRST TO GO!
ReplyDeleteTHROWING UP SEVEN DIFFERENT TYPES OF SMOKE AND STILL CAN'T PUT OUT THE FIRE -REAP THE WHIRLWIND MY FRIENDS REAP IT!
ReplyDeleteSo, 12:49, you would allow Dawson to remain at the law school as the Director of Legal Writing? I really don't care who put the info out about Dawson's paper. The fact of the matters remains that her writing is poor and someone else needs to be directing the students. Hell, even the students themselves have been complaining about her competence (or lack thereof).....way before this paper was discussed in the St. Pete Times. I just don't get how you guys think she is the victim here. What about the students who have incurred hundreds of thousands of dollars in student loan debt to obtain a quality legal education?
ReplyDelete4:33--Quit making excuses. Drafts that are forwarded to a publisher should not be riddled with grammatical errors, poorly-constructed and ambiguous statements. Just admit that the so-called "draft" was shoddy writing, and Ms Dawson simply did not know any better and put that thing out there as a final document. GirlF thought it was good, obviously. Draft, right. I got your draft.
ReplyDeleteto 8:50 AM Anonymous said...
ReplyDelete95% of the jobs at the LAW SCHOOL were obtained through "personal" ties'. I HAD NOT PERSONAL TIES to anyone at the law school or the university so I didn't get my job just because who I knew! I went to college, got the education needed and APPLIED for the job not knowing if I'd get it or not. You CANNOT ASSUME that everythere got their job just cause they knew someone already! GET YOUR FACTS STRAIGHT BEFORE SPREADING LIES!
Anon at 2:02, no one is saying anyone is a victim. The fact is that if the law school want to clean house everyone one who is out of order should be cleaned out. Students in the past complained of academic and ethical issues (involving faculty, administrators, etc.) and most of those issues remained unresolved.
ReplyDeleteTaking out one dean did not work. Taking out other specific persons in faculty and administration did not work. The problems are systemic and integrated into the fabric of the persons pulling strings. If the president of FAMU and the Board wants to resolve the issues they better start cleaning house from the top down. They certainly do not want the law school alumni who have held their tongue out of concern for the current students and whatever dignity FAMU has left to start talking. Most are out here with a heavy student loan debt defending themselves against the "FAMU" reputation. If they keep swallowing that bitter pill, they just might turn bitter.
It's nice to see that some blacks will stand by others to the end...even if it means that they wasted three years of their lives going to a law school that cannot be accredited.
ReplyDeletePerhaps Dawson wrote her article in ebonics. Perhaps that is why some of you feel it is acceptable and she should remain the example the legal writing department should strive to emulate.
Personally, I think it's time for her resignation, the resignation of Witherspoon, and maybe even the transfer of the school to a top notch university who wants one, such as UCF. Maybe even FIU could turn FAMU's COL into a branch campus for them and have two great law schools instead of FIU having a good program with the highest bar passage rate and FAMU having a school that actually discredits the black population.
4 words to law school faculty, students and those who post on message boards ---
ReplyDeleteSPELL and GRAMMAR CHECK
If our law students didn't complain to the newspaper, how did they even hear about her writing? We've got to support our outstanding professors, and cut the others loose. Is she a member of the Bar? If not figure it's because she couldn't pass the writing part.
ReplyDeleteAnother error? Welcome-mate? or Welcome mat? If y'all want to defend welcome-mate, please tell me what it is!
As a FAMU professor, I have had similar experiences. It is the sad result of low admission standards. Many of these students would be better served at a community college learning the things that they were supposed to pick up in high school.
ReplyDelete"I teach senior level and graduate classes in one of SBI's "flagship" programs. A few semesters ago, I changed my testing format from multiple choice to short answer. I also had the students write papers for me. I came to the sad realization that and most (80%)of my students are marginally literate. How in the WORLD did they make it to senior status?
I yelled. I shamed them. I encouraged them. I loved them. I sent them to a tutor. I refused to accept illiteracy. They had to keep re-writing until it was correct.
In the end, they still could not write. It was too late for me to help them. It will only be a matter of months before their new employer finds out that we have confirmed graduation upon another barely literate African-American.
Our reputation will sink further.
I had a good cry.
God help us.
6/07/2007 10:56 AM
HEY 10:56 AND 7:46- GET REAL! How dare you be so arrogant as to blame the students. Did you teach VD in community college on your way to FAMU b/c it sounds like you are intimate with her deficiencies. Your comment wasn't well written the first time so please if you as a "professor" can't come up with an original thought twice in a day- just do us all a favor and DONT POST! It is beyond ignorant of you to try to focus this blame on the students. The students invested their loan money, their time, their careers, their hopes- I could go on- in the COL and it let them down. RUTHITLER let them down, PANSIES that could care less about the school and are only focused on their paychecks let them down. Poisionous cobras that are in the wrong eco system let them down. If you teach at the law school and you think that it is okay for the LEGAL WRITING DIRECTOR to have SERIOUS GLARING PROBLEMS IN GRAMMAR AND SIMPLE WRITING-NOT EVEN SCHOLARLY WRITING BUT SAY FOR INSTANCE SYLLABI, EMAILS ETC. - then you should definetly be one of the first people to recieve a pink slip- OUR IGNORANCE AS A PEOPLE IS NO LONGER ACCEPTABLE-BEING BLACK DOESN'T EQUATE WITH IT BEING OKAY TO BE SECOND RATE-SING YOUR HYMN AND GO BACK TO THE PLANTATION WHILE PROGRESSIVE AFRICAN AMERICANS SAVE THIS SCHOOL AND MAKE A DIFFERENCE IN THE WORLD! WAKE UP!
ReplyDeleteFyi to earlier blogger - I did catch my own misspelled words the corrected version is shown below "You should definitely be one of the first ones to receive a pink slip" See it is okay to be wrong and humble about it. It is not okay to be wrong and maniacal about it.
ReplyDeleteHey baby ruth wake up and smell the fire burning- baby- its falling down around your ears and you are too much of a wussy to stand up and DO THE RIGHT THING. Go to blockbuster rent the movie and then try to make some administrative decisions it might work better than the method you are using now! good job!
ReplyDeleteBY THE WAY DINOSAURS AKA LUNDY BULLOCK IF YOU SPENT AS MUCH TIME WRITING AS YOU DO BEING MINIONS TO THE EVIL ONE YOU MIGHT HAVE ONE ARTICLE (BETWEEN THE BOTH OF YOU) PUBLISHED UM I DON'T KNOW BY NEXT YEAR- GOOD JOB SENIOR FACULTY WAY TO GO- SO WHEN THE ABA GETS HERE YOU WILL SAY WELL I DON'T HAVE ANYTHING PUBLISHED BUT I DID SPEND MY SUMMER BEING EXECRABLE- (LOOK IT UP IF YOU'RE CONFUSED) AND DEAN OOPS SORRY INTERIM DEAN WITHERSPOON WHY BOTHER WITH CONFERENCES WHEN YOU CAN'T EVEN MANAGE TO GET STUDENTS GRADES POSTED IN A TIMELY MANNER-START SMALL THEN BUILD UP FROM THERE- MAYBE YOU SHOULD TRY ANSWERING PHONES- SEEMS MORE ALONG YOUR SKILLS PATH! MAKE SURE THIS ONE GETS PRINTED SO WITHERSPOON IS AWARE THAT NO ONE-REALLY RESPECTS HER AND EVEN HER " FRIENDS" BELIEVE THAT SHE IS AS INCOMPTENT AS VICTORIA!
ReplyDeleteWhat do you do when the shit hits the fan, you run and you hide behind your white van. Too bad you did not do what you knew that you should- it sucks to be stupid and this is not good. Not good for the law school not good for FAMU, let the door hit you where the good lord split you
ReplyDeleteRuth-your time here is thru. POETRY DE JOUR!
HOUSTON I BELIEVE I SMELL A RAT. WITHERSPOON, CASTELL, DOUGLAS, AND AUSTIN WERE PAID BY UNKNOWN SOURCES TO BRING ABOUT THE DEMISE OF THE LAW SCHOOL. IT IS TRUE AND THERE ARE DOCUMENTS TO PROVE IT-NOT ALL SHREDDERS WORK AT THE SCHOOL. ITS TIME TO CALL IN THE FEDS FOLKS-PLAY TIME IS OVER.
ReplyDeletetongue twister of the day:
ReplyDeletedont blame stupid people for being stupid, blame stupid people for putting stupid people in positions they are too stupid to perform. stupid people in positions they are too stupid to perform seem stupid but not as stupid as the stupid people that put stupid people in positions they are too stupid to perform because you have to be pretty stupid to be as stupid as the stupid people are that are in charge of decision making at the COL. Say it 3x super fast!
hey 11:39am you've been counted out. Being christian doesn't mean that you have to be stupid. Don't even disparage god like that-have a little more respect.
ReplyDelete"How dare you be so arrogant as to blame the students."
ReplyDeleteIf a college senior can not write a complete sentence, who else is to blame but themselves. There is plenty of help available on campus to those who want it.
A "Doctoral Research University" should not be spending its resources teaching kids how to put together a coherent sentence.
They should have those skills before they get to a prestigious DRU like FAMU.
Perhaps we should offer a non-credit basic skills class.
I say again, what would JESUS do? This sounds corny but if you are a true Christian, think about what Jesus would do or say and act accordingly. It is really that simple. I am barely religious, I don't go to church every day, don't pray everyday etc... but I don't have hald the venoms of the Christians that have posted comments here.
ReplyDeleteIf you think God would approve of your behavior and thought process, in other words, that you can be as nasty as you want to be to folks behind their backs and in front of them, trying to bring them down, then maybe you are praying to something other than the Christian God. There is nothing wrong with constructive criticism, but destructive criticism to a single black mother trying to do her best and to R. Witherspoon put in an impossible situation HAS GOT TO ANGER GOD. YOU WILL HAVE TO ANSWER FOR THIS. LOOK WITHIN YOUR HEART AND THEN TELL ME WHETHER YOUR BEHAVIOR IS CALLED FOR. AGAIN, LET'S UPLIFT NOT TEAR DOWN.
I say again, what would JESUS do? This sounds corny but if you are a true Christian, think about what Jesus would do or say and act accordingly. It is really that simple. I am barely religious, I don't go to church every day, don't pray everyday etc... but I don't have HALF the venoms of the Christians that have posted comments here.
ReplyDeleteSORRY: TYPO IN PREVIOUS EMAIL. AM I TO LOSE MY JOB ALSO? SORRY, I ALREADY WORK AT WALLMART (AS A MANAGER BUT STILL WALMART)
Anonymous at 9:22 and 9:25:
ReplyDeleteMost of the people on this board are filled with hatred. Some are marginally talented themselves, but they have no problem with heaping criticism and offering suggestions on topics beyond their level of understanding. This is nothing more than a high tech barbershop, where even the most woefully unqualified person can chime in on the topics of the day. Most of these folks love to spread gossip. Has anyone noticed that no such website exists for FSU or UF? Its because their workers and supporters understand how to keep problems on the low.
It is so much easier to hate than to love. Some of the most evil posters on this board are in church five and six times a week, surely, in the end, they will get their reward. As you sow, so shall you reap.
In spite of other claims by media advocates, reading and writing well are the essential keys to a good education, and they are certainly the key to most successful law practices. The practice of law consists largely of interpreting texts and writing persuasive responses.
ReplyDeleteAnyone teaching writing should expect others to hold her to a high standard.
You would not expect a fashion designer to ask for feedback on an outfit that was crudely thrown together. Or a house painter to ask others to evaluate work that was hastily sprayed up, with no regard for moldings and edges.
You would not expect a writing teacher to post material of the kind this prof did.
The question remains: Is this indicative of the quality of her work and her teaching?
If not, it's just an anomaly, perhaps one with a credible explanation.
If so, there's a problem here.
Her supervisors need to check into this. Perhaps everything is fine. Perhaps she needs additional training or reassignment.
hey 9:22 who put you in charge of being god spokesperson, seeing that you don't know if GOD told me to put this on about your single black mother you might want to REPENT YOURSELF AND SHUTUP!
ReplyDeleteHEY WALMART YOU PROBABLY CAN'T COMPREHEND WHAT IS GOING ON AT THE LAWSCHOOL STICK TO YOUR LEVEL STOCK SOME POTATO CHIPS, AND ONCE AGAIN SHUT UP! WHY ARE YOU POSTING HERE ANYWAY-TRYING TO GET IN TO LAW SCHOOL TO TAKE ONE OF DAWSON'S CLASSES-SOUNDS LIKE YOU TWO ARE JUST STUPID ENOUGH TO GET ALONG!
ReplyDelete9:46 you sometimey christian negros trip me out-every last once screaming what would jesus do, etc and posting on the website that they claim is BELOW THEM (but you obviously get on here to read it)CAN GO TO HELL B/C THAT IS WHERE YOUR HEARTS ARE ANYWAY IT IS USUALLY YOU PEOPLE THAT ARE THE MOST VENOMOUS, JUDGMENTAL BACKSTABBING, LYING SMILE IN YOUR FACE BUT WOULD STEAL A BANANA FROM A BABY AND DAMN SURE DON'T CARE ABOUT ANYONE BUT YOUR OVERRIGHTEOUS OVERPIOUS SELVES-LET GOD DO THE JUDGMENTS THAT IS HIS CATEGORY AND SINCE YOU ARE TOO STUPID TO EVEN KNOW THAT THEN ONCE AGAIN SHUT THE HELL UP!
ReplyDeleteaaah sssssssssssouuuuuuuuuuuuueeeeeeeeeeeee A STUCK PIG WILL SCREAM EVERY TIME-SCREAM ON PIGS SCREAM ON-IT HURTS TO BE TOLD WHAT YOU KNOW IN YOUR HEART TO BE THE TRUTH ABOUT YOUR ABILITIES DOESN'T IT! OUCH ANOTHER ONE BITES THE DUST-OH YEAH-ANOTHER ONE BITES THE DUST.
ReplyDeleteHey interim dean baby ruth do you read these? and more importantly do you post here? I wonder how many of these postings are you? Especially the ones defending VD? Makes you go HMMMMMMMMM?????????????????
ReplyDeleteITS RATTLER NATION-RATTLER NATION -WHERE VENOM LIVES -DIG IT RATTLER RATTLER NATION WE ARE THE RATTLERS OF THE NATION WHEN WE FIGHT WITH DELIBERATION WE CREATE A SENSATION-
ReplyDeleteVENOM IS NECESSARY TO PROTECT THE ORANGE AND THE GREEN BEING NICE TO IGNORANT PEOPLE DOES NOTHING THEY CONTINUE ALONG IN THEIR IGNORANCE - IT IS TIME TO CREATE A SENSATION IN THIS MF'a SO NIGGAS DON'T HAVE NO CHOICE BUT TO GET THE HELL ON. ALL YOU SOMETIMEY OFAY NIGGAS AT THE LAW SCHOOL THAT DON'T KNOW ANYTHING ABOUT BLEEDING ORANGE AND GREEN THAT COULD CARE LESS ABOUT THIS COL B/C ALL YOUVE DONE SINCE YOU'VE BEEN HIRED IS TO SET US UP FOR FAILURE-YOU ARE A TRAVESTY TO YOUR RACE-YOUVE DESECRATED A TRULY SPECIAL GIFT- GET THE HELL ON AND LET US TRUE RATTLERS DO WHAT WE DO TO SAVE THIS SCHOOL! SO IN THE WORDS OF SOMEONE-NANANANA NANANANA HEY HEY HEY GOOD BYE!
What would Jesus do? Well, if he needed a lawyer he wouldn't hire one who graduated from FAMU. And neither would I.
ReplyDeleteWe, the Rattler Nation would be well served to meet the standard of writing and civility exhibited by Anon@11:05.
ReplyDeleteWe all understand that there are issues that are unresolved at the lawschool and I have had my share of problems with many of the princples mentioned on,but we are better than this.
Let's stop the personal attacks and offer real insight and useful information.
While at FAMU, I have had the pleasure of "catching" members of the faculty and staff engaged in submitting to this blog. Many of us as students have even heard many of them reference the numerous communications on the blog, as well. Even, references to how they instigate matters or "expose" them to the outside world. Who knew it was this intesnse. I am not sure if many of you have noticed that many of the "insider" anecdotes are made during the business day. While the state subsidizes their $100,000 plus salaries, they have time to engage in gossip and continued lower level communications.
ReplyDeleteI realize now, why so many of the recent graduates wished they had transferred. It is too late for me, but if there is anyone who was led to this site that is thinking about FAMU, make another choice. For you see, FAMU COL, is a place enamored with the inappropriate, the unethical, and the unlawful...
This is my first time on the blog, as I too was forwarded the Victoria Dawson article. How do we expect students to pass the bar without staff with credentials that can challenge them and prepare them for the legal profession? I am in awe to here my faculty and staff talk about the COL, I am paying to attend. There are some accuracies in the statements made regarding our preparation for law school and the bar. Many of us, however, thought that the individuals hired were going to reinforce the notion that all students, but in particular minority students, can achieve irrespective of subsidized test scores. Many of us took the chance, even with low LSAT scores, and showed up having been told that you had the best! We were told that you would teach us how to master legal writing and the tools necessary to master the bar... and the profession. What happened to those ideals? Instead of guidance on improving writing and test taking skills, as well as, how to master my first year courses, all I heard was bickering and in-fighting. Financial aid was late, grades were late. You fired people, you hired people. You even fired some lady that never even came? What are you all doing? Talk to each other. Do so, behind closed doors. Retain some dignity in order to save the little opportunity we have left. It is not about you and you manipulating the rest of us. It is about a Law school with a horrid history that has been given an opportunity to rise above the ashes. I hope this summer will be a time for you all to focus on "our" future. We need all of you. Unfortunately, NO ONE has stepped up to the plate, thus far. As a result, I and hundreds of students are at risk. Lastly, I should inform you that I was given an opportunity to interview with 2 firms that spent the majority of my interview sessions making disparaging comments about "my" law school. One even stated that "y'all act like the master left the plantation, and you don’t know what to do with it." I did finally end up with another firm that hired me, “even though I went to FAMU COL”. This is what you have subjected us to.
I guess I must have some abused student syndrome.. or something. I have hope that one of you, in power, will stand up and fight for what is right and not settle for what is mediocre. If not, know that more students, like the one who wrote to that paper, will continue to do so, as a cry for help.
Thanks for the memories!
We,the Rattler Nation, would be well served to meet the standard of writing and civility exhibited by Anon@11:05.
ReplyDeleteWe all understand that there are issues at the law school and I have had my share of problems with the principles mentioned, but we are better than this.
Let's stop the personal attacks and offer real and insightful information.
Martin Luther King, Jr.
ReplyDeleteTHE PURPOSE OF EDUCATION
Morehouse College, Atlanta
1948
As I engage in the so-called "bull sessions" around and about the school, I too often find that most college men have a misconception of the purpose of education. Most of the "brethren" think that education should equip them with the proper instruments of exploitation so that they can forever trample over the masses. Still others think that education should furnish them with noble ends rather than means to an end.
It seems to me that education has a two-fold function to perform in the life of man and in society: the one is utility and the other is culture. Education must enable a man to become more efficient, to achieve with increasing facility the legitimate goals of his life.
Education must also train one for quick, resolute and effective thinking. To think incisively and to think for one's self is very difficult. We are prone to let our mental life become invaded by legions of half truths, prejudices, and propaganda. At this point, I often wonder whether or not education is fulfilling its purpose. A great majority of the so-called educated people do not think logically and scientifically. Even the press, the classroom, the platform, and the pulpit in many instances do not give us objective and unbiased truths. To save man from the morass of propaganda, in my opinion, is one of the chief aims of education. Education must enable one to sift and weigh evidence, to discern the true from the false, the real from the unreal, and the facts from the fiction.
The function of education, therefore, is to teach one to think intensively and to think critically. But education which stops with efficiency may prove the greatest menace to society. The most dangerous criminal may be the man gifted with reason, but with no morals.
The late Eugene Talmadge, in my opinion, possessed one of the better minds of Georgia, or even America. Moreover, he wore the Phi Beta Kappa key. By all measuring rods, Mr. Talmadge could think critically and intensively; yet he contends that I am an inferior being. Are those the types of men we call educated?
We must remember that intelligence is not enough. Intelligence plus character--that is the goal of true education. The complete education gives one not only power of concentration, but worthy objectives upon which to concentrate. The broad education will, therefore, transmit to one not only the accumulated knowledge of the race but also the accumulated experience of social living.
If we are not careful, our colleges will produce a group of close-minded, unscientific, illogical propagandists, consumed with immoral acts. Be careful, "brethren!" Be careful, teachers!
Anon @ 11:44 most graduates realized during the time at the law school that they would be in a pickle during interviews because of the "reputation." Some have even been questioned during legal proceedings by other so-called professionals about "that school." Most decided to start their own firms rather than go through the repeated humiliation at firms that already did not want them. Nothing like adversity to to force the personal choice between success or failure. Their treatment at the law school did not make them weaker, it made them fighters notwithstanding their treatment. Every student that has gone through the law school and survived with their dignity, ethics and professionalism in tact is a success. FAILURE IS NOT AN OPTION.
ReplyDeleteHow did this woman pass the Texas Bar Exam?
ReplyDeleteFor anyone who is familiar with the workings of the COL, you would know that Dawson lacks in many areas. It should not take the St. Pete times writing an article, as many students put their complaints in writing in March about Dawson. However these complaints were never even acknowledged by the administration, probably because of the ties she has. While we should always be skeptical of all media reports, it is high time that the truth be know.
ReplyDeleteI am so tired of so many educated, empowered COL students sitting by, saying 'don't rock the boat'- students threatening other students if they speak out. Of all institutions I am shocked that a HBCU would behave this way. I know we are only provisionally accredited, but how are you ver going to be an advocate for a client, when you can't even be an advocate for yourself. The injustice that is continuing at this school (the injustice being an administration who does not care about the students, doesn't communicate with the students) must come to an end. We must do what is right, and respect each others decisions regardless if you choose to fight or not.
Lastly, it is rumored that Witherspoon has lowered Johnson's grades (which have still not been posted on-line). All of Johnson's students have already been told their grades, so if this is true, be prepared for many students to find a reason to fight that injustice!
Sad, sad, truly sad. After all these years, the complicity continues.
ReplyDeleteThose who have made it through the law school know that the choice of speaking up is one of walking on hot coals or broken glass. From the begining there were students (whether or not they were academically or ethically sound) who were favored by certain faculty and staff and those students could do no wrong. "Other" students were left to fend for themselves. The few students who tried to or did in fact speak up and lodge complaints were punished (lower grades, lost opportunities, delayed procedures, release of confidential info, open threats in classrooms about what would happen to those who "make trouble", etc.).
When students are facing high student loans, family choices, employment risk and other pressures, their hands are tied unless they are willing to risk it all. Very few students did or could take that risk. Those who did, paid a price. Those who did, paid the price quietly so that other students could graduate. That in itself is a sacrifice.
Unity is required for that type of sacrifice. It is the type of unity that considers the good of the whole. Someone has to be the "face" that speaks for the group and that "face" will take a beating, a beating that is hard to recover from.
to anonymous 3:36, The words you speak are so true. It is times like these when we must come together, we must unite or change will never happen. I respect those who wish to remain silent, however those who wish to remain silent should thanks those who sacfrifice themselves at the expense of the school. I encourage all of those who have been on the receiving end of any of this to speak up, whether it is anonymous or not. For those of you who are willing to put your face out there and tke 'a beating' do it now before there is no more COL. I am willing to put my neck on the line, because I know at the end of the day I have to look myself in the mirror, and the only way I can do that is to fight for what is right.
ReplyDeleteMATUS HAS NEW STORY - DEAN OF LAW SCHOOL CHANGES STUDENTS GRADES - STUDENTS THAT JUST SOME HOW SEEM TO BE THE SAME STUDENTS THAT COMPLAINED ABOUT DAWSON-hmmm! UH OH- AND WHAT IS THIS- HE HAS DOCUMENTS THAT HE WAS TOLD BY RUTH DIDN'T EXIST? AND UH OH WHAT IS THIS-HE HAS COPIES OF DAWSON'S TEACHING EVALUATIONS- UH OH WHAT IS THIS HE HAS COPIES OF ALL THE LEGAL WRITING PROFESSORS TEACHING EVALUATIONS-UH OH WHAT IS THIS HE HAS ENOUGH INFORMATION TO...... THE SAGA CONTINUES
ReplyDeleteIt's a good thing Matus has all of this to publish the truth since that is something that is foreign to the administration. At least he does not have to fear adverse consequences like the rest of the students have had to do. Does anyone remember when the students at main campus called for the President's resignation... maybe it's time we do the same for Dawson and Witherspoon.
ReplyDeleteThere is power in numbers, we should not fear speaking out, so long as we do it together!
I guess no one is questioning why stories, whether truth or fiction, tend to come out just before a bar exam. It is one thing to print the truth, but it is quite another to print it with malice. PAYBACK ain't going to be pretty.
ReplyDeleteDawson like so many other female faculty at the COL are "kept women" of the men in power.sad but true. Dawson made it clear that she had "personal ties" with Nate Friends who along with Douglas support put her in the position of director.
ReplyDeleteWhy are we making the issue of incompetence and wrongdoing gender specific? Why target only the "female" faculty? If you allege that the "female" faculty is sleeping around to hold on to their $100,000 plus salaries then aren't the men equally to blame?
ReplyDeleteDear All,
ReplyDeleteI must admit that I am afraid of what's going on at FAMU. I applied to all the HBCU law programs plus a couple of non-HBCU's. I got into all but one. FAMU has been my top priority from day one. Why? 1. Orlando is a great city to get situated in 2. I would like to stay in state 3. After attending two "mainstream" universities, I would like a change in atmosphere.
However, the press is terrible. I watch the news, conduct searches, and read the blogs. It's very discouraging to see/hear what's going on. Is FAMU worth the expense and time?
Any advice would be appreciated.
Signed,
"Perplexed On-Looker"
P.S. I told myself that if push comes to shove, I'll attend FIU. But something is pulling me toward FAMU. Am I being too idealistic????
If you are an "independent" personality, someone who can function from day one with no support, the law school is worth the money. If you are someone who will finance necessities through financial aid, who will not have family close to provide general and emergency support, who will need academic support, who will need networking opportunities for jobs and professional introductions, etc., AND cannot function without additional support from the institution, go to a school that WILL provide all those things. This school is not for the weak. You must be firing on all cylinders on the day you enter the doors or you're simply rolling a dice on a huge debt.
ReplyDelete